Burnout - Exhaustion, Boundaries & Recovery

In the very first episode of Healthy Mind Happy Soul, host Brock Carter, PA-C sits down with psychiatric PA Hannah Eason to explore one of the most common mental health challenges in today’s world: burnout.

Together, they discuss:

•  What burnout actually is and how it differs from ordinary stress 
•  Early warning signs people often overlook 
•  Why burnout has become so widespread 
•  The emotional, physical, and cognitive impact of burnout 
•  How boundaries, mindfulness, rest, and self-awareness can support recovery 
•  When it may be time to seek professional help 

Hannah also shares her personal experience with burnout and the changes that helped her regain balance in both work and life.

Whether you’ve been feeling emotionally exhausted, disconnected, overwhelmed, or simply running on empty, this conversation offers practical insight, validation, and hope.

Healthy Mind Happy Soul is a mental health podcast produced by Animo Sano Psychiatry.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:03

Welcome to Healthy Mind, Happy Soul, a mental health podcast where we explore relevant, relatable topics that shape our minds in a rapidly changing world. I'm your host, Brock Carter, and I hope you'll join me on this journey as we bring science, empathy, and mindfulness together in one place to better understand ourselves. Our first episode is all about burnout. What it is, how it can sneak up on us, and how to recognize the early warning signs before we feel completely depleted. Today we're joined by psychiatric PA Hannah Eason, who not only helps us understand burnout from a practical and clinical perspective, but also shares her own personal experience with burnout and the steps that helped her overcome it. My hope is that this conversation will help you feel less alone, better equipped to recognize what your mind and body may be telling you, and more empowered to find your own recipe for rest, recovery, and healing. Hello, Hannah. Um, how are you today?

SPEAKER_01 1:08

Hi, Brock. I'm I'm good. I'm happy the sun's out. I'm happy it's Friday. How are you?

SPEAKER_00 1:16

I'm well, thank you. Yeah. Happy Friday to you as well. The sun is out. Thank you for joining us to share your insights and intel today on burnout.

SPEAKER_01 1:25

Yeah, no problem.

SPEAKER_00 1:27

How do we generally define burnout and how is it different from ordinary stress or just having a bad week?

SPEAKER_01 1:34

I mean, there's different ways you can define burnout, but most of the time in the literature, it's described as a work-related stress syndrome caused by long-term unmanaged stress. So usual definitions do include that occupational piece, but of course, we also know that personal and environmental factors can play a big part too. But it has a couple different dimensions to it, especially work-related burnout. So physical or emotional exhaustion, cynicism or detachment to your work or to people that you work with, reduced ability to work effectively, less personal satisfaction with your job. People who are burnt out are often extremely tired. And it goes beyond just tired. Like it's it's the fatigue that a good night's sleep won't fix. Right. Even if it's a job they initially feel pretty passionate about, they can feel detached from that mission. People who are burnt out may feel more cynical about their job or what they do. When you're burned out, it can affect your performance at work too. People often make more mistakes or take longer to complete tasks. And it's important to distinguish that it's not currently defined as a medical condition per se. So, for example, the the DSM doesn't recognize burnout as a mental health condition. Right. It's mostly recognized as a work-related syndrome. So it's not a medical diagnosis. There aren't medications that treat it, but of course, symptoms of burnout can overlap with medical conditions, which is getting in getting into a whole nother side of burnout that I think we'll discuss. But as far as differentiating normal stress and burnout, it can be difficult. Stress is a part of everybody's life. We have busy weeks, exhausting weeks, stressful weeks, months or years. Stress can happen when it feels like there's too much pressure at work or at home. And that will come and go. Burnout will come and go too. But burnout is what happens when that feeling of stress never goes away. When you're stressed, you might be anxious or worried, but generally still motivated and able to work effectively. Stress often improves with rest, right? You've had a stressful week. Yeah. You sleep in over the weekend and feel recharged for the week. But when you're burnout, you feel depleted, um, have huge difficulty feeling connected to people. Motivation is pretty low or absent. And like I've mentioned a couple of times, rest alone doesn't usually improve burnout, especially short term.

SPEAKER_00 4:21

I think you just did a great job at differentiating ordinary stress, just a bad week from burnout, because you gave examples of the downstream effects from burnout, the emotional toll, the cognitive toll. You had mentioned cynicism towards your job. You know, even if you love what you do, you know, I think that can sometimes make individuals feel guilty because you enjoy what you do, maybe you have a sense of purpose, but during burnout, you can kind of lose sight of that. And I think that you had mentioned that too, that that disconnection from people sometimes, that feeling. But these are all the ways we can feel when we're burned out. Are there smaller versions of these signs or symptoms? Are there other early warning signs of burnout that we can often miss until we realize we're already here?

SPEAKER_01 5:11

Burnout often builds up unnoticed. So it can be very insidious. Um people often don't realize they're burned out until they feel very thoroughly burned out. Um as many as three out of four American workers reported moderate to high burnout at work in 2025.

SPEAKER_00 5:36

Um 75% of the workforce burned out. What, yeah, I had to interrupt that because that was an alarming figure to me, clearly. But what could be driving three-fourths of our population to be so exhausted and burned out? Is it long hours? Is it dissatisfaction? Is it uh increased demands? Like what's happening there?

SPEAKER_01 6:00

That's that's an that's a very large yeah, and there was some some difference across the diff um the different generations. So Gen Z reported the highest rates of burnout, 75%, while about 66% of millennials reported burnout. Um so it wasn't the same across every age group, but yeah, that's pretty um uh pretty ubiquitous when you think about it. There can be some physical signs like headaches, muscle tension, sleep issues, um, so difficulty falling or staying asleep. And then some other early warning signs can be feeling over irritability or little patience, um, a sense of apathy about your job, or even complaining a lot about work, um, feeling depleted or really severe case of the Sunday scaries, right? You know, no most of us don't want to go back to work on Monday, but if you're dreading it every every weekend um or whenever your work week starts, that could be a sign that you're starting to burn out.

SPEAKER_00 7:13

I'm very glad you brought up the term Sunday Scaries. It's becoming more ubiquitous. Um, and it relates to this 75% of the population maybe experiencing burnout. What are the biggest contributors to burnout in today's world? Is it long hours, you know, increased demands? Why are we all talking about the Sunday Scaries and why this 75%?

SPEAKER_01 7:38

Yeah, so I think there are actually some studies on this, not necessarily as it pertains to today's world specifically, but I'll get to that in a moment. But as far as the biggest workplace contributors, there are really six key areas. So you already mentioned that work demand, also lack of control at work, not having a say in your schedule or how decisions are made, yeah, insufficient recognition or reward at work. So feeling like the good work that you do isn't recognized or isn't important.

SPEAKER_00 8:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 8:15

Lack of community at work, lack of fairness with how people are treated or how decisions are made, or even conflict with values at work, how people are treated or or how the decisions are made. Does that actually conflict with what's important to you? Um, so those are the biggest workplace contributors that I think could apply to any time period. But as far as today's world, I mean, I think there are so many contributors. COVID was a huge one and still is. I know that there are many healthcare workers that still feel like they're recovering from the burnout they experienced, especially our front, our frontline workers, um, our healthcare professionals in the ER. True. There's also a lot of increasing uncertainty in the world, I'll say. I mean, with global politics and US politics, there are wars happening. Housing and food costs continue to skyrocket while wages are stagnant or layoffs continue. I think also how much time we spend isolated, especially maybe those of us who work from home, how much time we spend looking at screens or our phones, that can interfere with our ability to have that community, right? We're spending too much time on technology. But then also looking at screens is actually more cognitively demanding than looking at a book or reading off of a piece of paper. Um so I think all of these things could explain why we're seeing as many as um 75% of people having experienced burnout last year.

SPEAKER_00 10:02

You know, with those six areas that you mentioned as driving contributing factors to burnout, work demand, lack of control, insufficient recognition, a lack of community or maybe collegiality, um, fairness in the workplace, or even conflict with values. It does make sense how more people in almost every aspect or any facet may experience one of those six. You know, those are a lot of contributing factors. So I I agree, you know, especially like you gave a great example uh with the pandemic and healthcare workers, the demands went up. Um there was a lot of lack of control there, right? Maybe if you're traveling, you don't have the collegiality, the lack of community, your support systems. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 10:51

Or working from home.

SPEAKER_00 10:53

Yeah, or working from home, or maybe working in conditions where at that time it was high acuity, high volume. Yeah, and you may have an ethical conflict with that as a nurse who might say, I I'm used to four, four patients, six patients, whatever it may be. True. Um, but yeah, those are all great examples of of driving factors. We brought up rest. Um, I think that's very important too, because it's if it's exhaustion and you're burned out, you need to rest. That makes sense. Um, but some people who experience burnout may feel guilty for slowing down. Because, like we said, you could still enjoy what you do. Uh, and maybe you're feeling burnout and you're slowing down, and you feel bad about that, or maybe you like you're underperforming, and that can contribute to some depression symptoms, some stress. Maybe you feel bad about yourself. Why is finding time to rest difficult for someone who's burned out when your natural instincts are, I'm exhausted, I need a little rest. It's it's time, it's it's hard to find this time to rest. Why do you why do you think that is?

SPEAKER_01 12:00

Yeah. So I think there are a lot of reasons. Um there is a study that shows type A personalities. Um, so people who are very competitive, driven, um, motivated are actually more prone to burnout. And I think uh people's type A personalities, it can be very hard to slow down. Um, it might feel like giving up to slow down. Maybe they've never tried it. Or maybe slowing down causes its own form of distress because slowing down actually means more time with your thoughts, right? Um, some people use work as a distraction. But in addition to that, I mean, not just type A personalities can um experience burnout. Anyone can. Um, there's lots of other reasons too. Certainly, personal factors contribute, like taking care of kids or family members. Right. If you've got a sick kid or a sick parent that you're taking care of, really difficult to slow down unless you have adequate support, you know, people who can step in and help. Maybe there are financial pressures. So somebody has to work two jobs to pay their bills or take care of their kids. And it truly doesn't seem to be an option for them to slow down because they won't be able to pay the rent. So there are a lot of, a lot of different factors.

SPEAKER_00 13:29

I often hear I don't have time to slow down. I don't have time to rest because you know you're going right from work, maybe to a second job. In between that, you're getting the kids, you're getting things ready. There's no time to slow down.

SPEAKER_01 13:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 13:44

And that can be a big problem when rest might be the recipe. So if you can't rest, if there's not enough time for that, how can someone tell whether they need better self-care or setting stronger boundaries or maybe a change of environment or even professional help if rest isn't an option?

SPEAKER_01 14:04

This is a complicated question. And I think it is very hard to tell sometimes. I mean, even for me, I see a lot of burnout, have you know quite a bit of experience with this. But I mean, even for me, when when I'm trying to look at myself and what's needed for me, I struggle too. So everybody's answer is going to be different, and likely there's gonna be multiple different areas to make changes instead of just one of them. But I think the first step is looking at your job, like your environment, but specifically your job. And there's a couple questions you can ask yourself that I think are helpful um in exploring this. So do I feel like there is too much on my plate at work? Am I constantly working beyond my schedule or what's required of me? Do I have too little input or say in my job? Do I have too little support from coworkers or managers? Is there too much conflict at work? Does what happened at work conflict with my values? Am I or other people being treated poor at work? And I think if the answer is yes to any of those questions, that warrants further exploration. Now that doesn't mean just because you answered yes to one of those questions that your job is a horrible fit and you've got to start over and try something else. Of course, no job is perfect. But if there are serious issues, like you're answering yes to a lot of those questions, it could mean that you either talk to your boss or HR about some changes, or it could mean that you seek a different environment or a better fit.

SPEAKER_00 15:50

Someone might fear going to HR or going to their employer, maybe out of showing weakness. Is there any potential that that could play a part? I've heard I've heard people express these things before.

SPEAKER_01 16:03

I certainly have. And I think those are usually environments where people need the most change because they they don't feel safe talking about the issues that they're having because it's either been communicated that it doesn't matter, um, or they've seen others um suffer consequences of speaking up. So I think that is a warning sign in and of itself.

SPEAKER_00 16:31

Finding what resources you have, setting boundaries, asking yourself these questions, lists of pros and cons, um, making small changes for better self-care routines. Cause just like you said, it's not going to be a specific recipe for everybody because you know your burnout is not going to match somebody else's burnout.

SPEAKER_01 16:52

Yeah. So as far as self-care goes, self-care is always important. And I think again, there's a couple questions you can ask yourself to start exploring this. Question number one: Do I feel rested? What do I do to take care of myself? And then furthermore, what does taking care of myself actually mean to me? Is that something I've thought about before? What do I do that fills my cup rather than drains my energy? Do I spend any of my day relaxing or being present? So not reading, not watching, not scrolling, on your phone, just being. Am I spending my time in ways that don't align with what I want or what I value? So for example, am I spending too much time on social media? Am I spending too much time watching TV, etc.? I think those answers can give you some insight into how better to care for yourself or at least even start thinking about these things. I mean, if you've been working for a long time, it might be a while since you've thought about these things, if ever. If you're not resting enough, that's a really good place to start. It's recommended to get at least seven hours of sleep per night. Some people may do fine with less, some people need more. But a wind-down routine of at least 30 minutes, doing something relaxing before bed, and then planning to try and sleep for seven plus hours can improve your mental and physical health. Like I said earlier, rest alone usually isn't enough to help with burnout. Something else to think about is that mindfulness has a lot of evidence for stress reduction. So stress or even severe stress will come and go in our lives. Mindfulness teaches us how to be present with what is and can often cultivate wisdom about ourselves or a situation to know what's needed. Mindfulness is just paying attention on purpose, if we're going to try to boil it down and simplify it. The more you observe yourself, your surroundings, the more wisdom and clarity you can get sometimes. Mindfulness also teaches that there's always room to breathe and be just as you are. Even just pausing for 30 seconds to take a deep breath can make you feel less anxious, make you feel more calm. If you do want to get started with deep breathing or mindfulness, something that's really simple and accessible to most people is four, seven, eight breathing. So that's breathing in for four seconds, holding your breath for seven, and breathing out for eight. If that feels too long, you just cut all of that in half. The most important thing is that you're exhaling twice as long as you're inhaling. And that's a signal to your brain and your body that you're safe and it's okay to relax. So those are some places to start with self-care if you don't know where to start. If you are constantly saying yes to everything that's asked of you or pushing yourself past your limits, it's a good idea to look at your boundaries or start setting them. This can feel overwhelming, but even small changes can go a long way. For example, turning off work notifications after 6 p.m. or scheduling do not disturb on your phone for two hours every night. Any small change can lead to big change over time. And I think on that same vein, something I see frequently overlooked by my patients who are burned out, is the importance of taking breaks throughout your day. If you are feeling burned out and you are not taking breaks throughout your day, that's the first place to start if possible. People may feel like they can't take a break because there's too much to do, or maybe your workplace doesn't allow breaks, which is problematic. But studies have shown that even short micro breaks, no longer than 10 minutes, can have a positive effect on well-being or energy. But coming back to your point, Brock, about um people may not have enough time. And I hear that, and and I have certainly felt that, but we all have five or 10 minutes that we can start with, right? So a good place to start with taking breaks, especially if you work from home or at a computer all day, is to set a lunch break. A lot of folks who work from home over time kind of start foregoing a lunch break without even realizing it until I talk to them. Um, it could be 30 minutes to start, but 30 minutes where you actually leave your workstation, you stay away from screens, you eat, maybe you go outside, maybe you take a quick walk. But I also recommend micro breaks of five to 10 minutes at least once in the morning and at least once in the afternoon, if not more over time. But those are really good places to start with taking breaks. I used to see patients for six hours straight, no breaks, um, in order to get in order to get through my day faster. I was in total control of my schedule. Um, so this is something. That I did to myself. And I really started to realize over time that that was not sustainable for me. But I kept comparing myself to other people, you know, seeing other people could work, you know, much longer hours. Um, you know, I see patients virtually as you do to Brock. And sitting on a computer all day really takes it out of me. Um so now I see patients in chunks for no longer than three hours without taking a break. And there are definitely colleagues of mine out there who can really power through it and work for much longer, and it's just not me.

unknown 22:44

Sure.

SPEAKER_01 22:44

And that's something I've I've had I've had to uh learn to accept. But as far as signs that somebody might need professional help um for burnout, I mean, one, I think anybody experiencing burnout could benefit from talking to a therapist, especially if you're having trouble navigating on how to make changes. But serious signs that professional help is needed include persistent feelings of hopelessness, um, persistent insomnia, anxiety, thoughts of suicide, or um relying on drugs and alcohol to cope with your stress.

SPEAKER_00 23:25

All valid reasons to go seek professional help, uh, because those could all be signs that it's something bigger. And thank you very much for sharing your personal experience with you running into some burnout, finding some personal challenges and boundaries, and then finding maybe a a way to fix that. And if you don't mind me asking, did your formula work for you in reducing overall stress and burnout? Did the recipe work?

SPEAKER_01 23:55

It yes, it has. Um it has. I think it's something I am constantly evaluating because I also have another job. I also own a business. And so trying to balance all of that with my personal life can be difficult. Um, so yes, it has helped, but I think that just goes to show that this is something that you should kind of constantly be um, or not constantly, but frequently evaluating, especially if you felt burned out before, then maybe it's easier to rec to recognize those signs and and start making another change.

SPEAKER_00 24:38

We did talk about how it's case by case, person to person, you know, burnout will shift, um, given its underlying cause or your work demands. You found a recipe that worked for you, and that's awesome. And it's up to others to maybe use these questions you provided that were very thoughtful, very mindful questions that offer an opportunity for self-reflection. That's a very good start. Um, I think you framed that perfectly. Um, do a self-evaluation, ask yourself those questions. Um, those are those first steps you can take. Um, and if things keep going despite changes, maybe seek professional help because it could be something bigger. Um, and as the framework for our diagnostic system evolves and changes on its own, uh there will be better definitions for these things, but it doesn't change our symptoms, right? And the things we experience and the fact that if they're too burdensome, we probably need some help.

SPEAKER_01 25:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 25:38

For someone listening right now who feels exhausted, numb, or maybe stuck, what would you want them to hear first if they came to you?

SPEAKER_01 25:48

Yeah, I mean, one, you're definitely not alone. Um two, admitting that something is not working is not the same as giving up. And then three, small changes can have huge uh impacts. And I think that's those are the three things I would want somebody to hear first.

SPEAKER_00 26:16

I agree. I think it shows strength to identify where you might be falling behind a bit and you might need to set some boundaries, and that shows good self-care. You know, you're a good evaluator of your own best interest. You're trying to make change, and I think that's always positive. So very, very well said. Thank you for joining us. It's been awesome having you here and hearing your insights into burnout. And I'm glad you found a recipe to uh cure your own burnout. And for those listening, uh, hope you find your own recipe as well.

SPEAKER_01 26:52

Thank you, Brock. It was a pleasure speaking with you today.

SPEAKER_00 26:56

Absolutely. I hope we hear from you again in the future.

SPEAKER_01 26:58

For sure.

SPEAKER_00 27:00

A huge thank you to Hannah Eason for joining us today and sharing both her insight and her personal experience so openly. If there's one thing to take away from this conversation, it's that burnout is not a personal failure. It's often a signal that something in our life, workload, environment, or expectations needs attention. Hannah's story reminds us that recovery is possible, but it often starts with honesty and learning what kind of rest we truly need. I hope this episode helps you feel seen, encouraged, and a little more prepared to care for yourself when burnout starts to show up. Thank you for listening to our first episode of Healthy Mind, Happy Soul, a mental health podcast brought to you and produced by Animosano Psychiatry, a behavioral health practice based in North Carolina. Until next time, take care of your mind, and your soul will follow.